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E-mail Message: I thought you might be interested in this item at http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/85484978 Title: So help me God : the founding fathers and the first great battle over church and state Author: F Forrester Church Publisher: Orlando : Harcourt, ©2007. ISBN/ISSN: 9780151011858 0151011850 OCLC:85484978

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So help me God : the founding fathers and the first great battle over church and state

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So help me God : the founding fathers and the first great battle over church and state

Author:	F Forrester Church
Publisher:	Orlando : Harcourt, ©2007.
Edition/Format:	Book : English : 1st edView all editions and formats
Summary:	Today's dispute over the line between church and state (or the lack thereof) is neither the first nor the fiercest in our history. In this retelling of the birth of the American body politic, religious historian Forrest Church describes our first great culture war-a tumultuous yet nearly forgotten conflict that raged from George Washington's presidency to James Monroe's. On one side of the battle, the proponents of Read more...
Rating:	based on 1 rating(s) 1 with a review

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Material Type:	Internet resource
Document Type:	Book, Internet Resource
All Authors / Contributors:	F Forrester Church Find more information about:
ISBN:	9780151011858 0151011850
OCLC Number:	85484978
Description:	530 p. ; 24 cm.
Contents:	Act I. George Washington. Out of many, one -- With liberty and order for all -- Unum versus pluribus -- Act II. John Adams. A churchgoing animal -- Black cockades and tricolors -- "Order is heaven's first law" -- "The grand question -- Act III. Thomas Jefferson. The American dreamer -- For Jefferson and liberty -- Utopia meets reality -- Act IV. James Madison. Constructing freedom's altar -- Defending the empire of liberty -- Act V. James Monroe. All for one and one for all -- Considerations of humanity.
Responsibility:	Forrest Church.
More information:	Table of contents only Contributor biographical information Publisher description Sample text

Abstract:

Today's dispute over the line between church and state (or the lack thereof) is neither the first nor the fiercest in our history. In this retelling of the birth of the American body politic, religious historian Forrest Church describes our first great culture war-a tumultuous yet nearly forgotten conflict that raged from George Washington's presidency to James Monroe's. On one side of the battle, the proponents of order--Federalists, Congregationalists, New Englanders--believed that the only legitimate ruler of men is God. On the other side, the defenders of liberty--republicans, Baptists, Virginians--cheered the Enlightenment and the French Revolution, and believed that only the separation of church and state would preserve man's freedom. Would we be a nation under God, or with liberty for all? In this vigorous history, Church offers a new vision of our earliest presidents' beliefs, reshaping assumptions about the debates that still reverberate across our land.--From publisher description.

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WorldCat User Reviews (1)

Well Documented, Learned a lot

by dcornwall (WorldCat user published 2010-06-05) Excellent

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Before I say anything about the book’s narrative content, I want to stress that this is a very well documented book. Aside from consulting the collected writings of:

Abigail Adams
John Adams
Alexander Hamilton
Thomas Jefferson
Dolley Madison
James...
Read more...

Before I say anything about the book’s narrative content, I want to stress that this is a very well documented book. Aside from consulting the collected writings of:

Abigail Adams
John Adams
Alexander Hamilton
Thomas Jefferson
Dolley Madison
James Madison
James Madison
George Washington

Dr. Church has compiled a 17 page bibliography of primary and secondary sources. From this bibliography, Dr. Church documents his history with 43 pages of end-notes. So if you challenge his assertions while reading this 450 page book, read the associated endnotes, pull those sources and draw your own conclusions.

The plan of the book is simple enough. The story of church/state relations in the United States from 1789-1825 is told as a play in five acts. One Act for each of America’s five presidents. These would be George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison and James Monroe.

The book answers the burning question of whether the Founding Fathers intended the United States to be a secular country or a Christian nation with a resounding: YES! It depends on who you asked. John Adams and Thomas Jefferson would have given you very different answers. This outcome makes sense to me. We’re still fighting over the question now. It makes sense the question was first asked at the Founding.

Dr. Church does a good job of humanizing our first five Presidents and explores what is known of their faith and church going habits pretty thoroughly. He also points out some surprising facts about early US history and has the contemporary news clippings to prove it:

In the early Republic, much of the country considered July 4th to be a pagan festival that good Christians were obliged to avoid.
Wearing Red, White and Blue proved that your were a French influenced atheist and person of loose morals. Patriotic people, at least in New England, wore black.
Baptists were huge fans of separating Church and State. Episcopalians demanded state churches and public financing.
New Englanders considered the War of 1812 to be the judgment of God against an immoral nation. They were on the verge of seceding and joining “Christian” England when the Americans unexpectedly won.
Sunday worship services were held on the floor of the House of Representatives.
Clerical influenced newspapers treated Jefferson’s election even more harshly than Fox treated Obama’s election.

If you’re interested in navigating the twists and turns of religion in early America, I think you will find this book interesting and engaging. But you may leave it with more questions than answers.

Was this review helpful to you?

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"Today's dispute over the line between church and state (or the lack thereof) is neither the first nor the fiercest in our history. In this retelling of the birth of the American body politic, religious historian Forrest Church describes our first great culture war-a tumultuous yet nearly forgotten conflict that raged from George Washington's presidency to James Monroe's. On one side of the battle, the proponents of order--Federalists, Congregationalists, New Englanders--believed that the only legitimate ruler of men is God. On the other side, the defenders of liberty--republicans, Baptists, Virginians--cheered the Enlightenment and the French Revolution, and believed that only the separation of church and state would preserve man's freedom. Would we be a nation under God, or with liberty for all? In this vigorous history, Church offers a new vision of our earliest presidents' beliefs, reshaping assumptions about the debates that still reverberate across our land.--From publisher description."

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Well Documented, Learned a lot

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